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stamstamstam

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Joined: Tue Jul 19, 2016 12:50 am

Post Tue Jul 19, 2016 5:42 pm

Mod feedback

Hey guys, I know you didn't ask for it, and I'm pretty sure you're not planning to put more work into the mod, but I'm gonna share my feedback about few aspect of the mod.
Don't take me wrong, you made an amazing job and I'm more than impressed, but with some more tweaks it could turn into a legendary mod.
While playing I kept thinking "damn, that thing could be improved" but I didn't think about creating a list, so I forgot 95% of the things.

The 4 main big things that bugged me the most were:
- "wait" function looks like it's been disabled within locations, I have no idea why, it would prove very useful on many occasions
- grabbing stuffs from shelves/chests/desks not being noticed/prohibited in 99% of the time. I was able to grab ammos, weapons and that sort of things without any consequence. I was then able to use this loot or sell it, greatly influencing my progression. Of course, one can say "then don't loot it", but as long as it's not prevented by the game except on rare occasions, why wouldn't I? I just feel it has a bad effect on the progression and immersion.
- Shelves/safes trapped with no way to get access to their content after killing some NPCs. To me it's a bit unfair, I remember that gun seller in Reno (Fallout 2) which I was able to kill and access his stuff, it's a decision but at least it wasn't artifically blocked, that's frustrating.
- Sometimes, the quests rewards are unbalanced. I was surprised that the XP or caps reward for some quests was pretty low compared to the risk and the difficulty of it.
Again, I didn't take notes, but I'm sure other players have noticed that.

Minor things:
- some quests could benefit from having more ways to resolve them. For example, in the starting location, after finding the necklace, the only option offered to me for the "good" one was to plant the necklace. My character has very low "steal" stat, so it never worked. In order to end that quest, I had to report the guy (which had the consequence to lower my karma).
I'm also thinking about Sedit and the ring, my character sucks at hand fighting, and so does my companions. I can't beat Cedrick and therefore I can't finish that quest. I know it's possible to convince Vodka to fight for me but my speech is too low, that would be great to add another way to convince him for instance.
- There are not enough merchants, or at least they're selling too much of the same content.
- Don't put Chuck in a quest where he's supposed to get killed. He's like the best merchant, and I barely had the chance to buy from him. Also, I couldn't obtain that special weapon for the Imperial city... (even tho I found the blueprints).
- I feel that encounters on the world map are also very redundant, it gets boring quickly.
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Daemon

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Joined: Fri Dec 14, 2007 9:49 pm

Post Tue Jul 19, 2016 7:40 pm

Re: Mod feedback

Thank you for your feedback.

There's always something to improve and something to add. There's lot of old stuff in Resurrection that we would have done differently today and we certainly see lot of places asking for improvement. We were doing lot of changes through out of development but we had to stop ourselves eventually otherwise we wouldn't have ever finished it. 10 years is way too long time (not to mention another years for translation) and we're kind of burn out. That's why we won't be adding anything new or making significant changes. I don't mean it wrong, I'm just clarifying our perspective. Nothing wrong in sending us feedback, I myself am glad to read it and discuss it.

To some of your points:
- There's no wait function. It's sleeping and the players were always abusing it for healing in the original Fallout games. Sleeping anywhere was too easy way to gain health. And it makes more sense too, that you can't just sleep on the streets and have to find yourself a hotel room if it's possible or risk sleeping in the wasteland.
- Lots of shelves/chests/desks are guarded or locked, especially those with valuable stuff. Looting is valid way to gain resources. And useful way for thief-like character.
- Shelves/safes trapped with explosives can be accessed with high enough trap skill. If a merchant have large amount of items and can be easily killed without big consequences (like not making others hostile towards you), then it's quite cheap way to gain lot of valuable stuff. That would create the same problem you criticize in the previous point.
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stamstamstam

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Joined: Tue Jul 19, 2016 12:50 am

Post Tue Jul 19, 2016 8:49 pm

Re: Mod feedback

Daemon wrote:- There's no wait function. It's sleeping and the players were always abusing it for healing in the original Fallout games. Sleeping anywhere was too easy way to gain health. And it makes more sense too, that you can't just sleep on the streets and have to find yourself a hotel room if it's possible or risk sleeping in the wasteland.


I'm not going to argue about that, it's your decision. But it has an impact in some quests, for example the one where the player has to meet the kidnappers near the brahmin pen at 11PM. In my game, it was 9PM, with no way to speed up the time, and whenever I tried to move my character in the world map, time always passed beyond 11PM. I can remember 1 or 2 quests based on a specific time like that. If you don't like that healing effect, why not simply desactivating it?

Daemon wrote:- Lots of shelves/chests/desks are guarded or locked, especially those with valuable stuff. Looting is valid way to gain resources. And useful way for thief-like character.


Looting is valid to gain ressources, but when I'm opening chests and lockers next to imperial soldiers and they're not saying anything about it, it's slightly immersion breaking.
"No problem, you can take those ammos and those grenades stranger, we won't need those".
Most of the time players won't pay attention, but there exceptions where it looks odd. What's the point in having a "sneak" skill if it's not necessary?
It feels especially off when other NPC"s will react when you try to loot their containers.

Daemon wrote:- Shelves/safes trapped with explosives can be accessed with high enough trap skill. If a merchant have large amount of items and can be easily killed without big consequences (like not making others hostile towards you), then it's quite cheap way to gain lot of valuable stuff. That would create the same problem you criticize in the previous point.


There are other ways to circumvent that problem, by adding guards around the merchant, or buffing the guy so a low level character won't be match for him. There are also cops/militias in most cities, killing a merchant in order to steal his stock will always antagonize them.
It's all about risk and reward, and adding an auto-destruction system felt a bit artificial.
Once again, it's your decision and I respect that, I'm just sharing my feelings about your (great) mod.
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NovaRain

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Joined: Fri Jul 15, 2016 5:40 pm

Post Tue Jul 19, 2016 11:21 pm

Re: Mod feedback

stamstamstam wrote:I'm not going to argue about that, it's your decision. But it has an impact in some quests, for example the one where the player has to meet the kidnappers near the brahmin pen at 11PM. In my game, it was 9PM, with no way to speed up the time, and whenever I tried to move my character in the world map, time always passed beyond 11PM. I can remember 1 or 2 quests based on a specific time like that. If you don't like that healing effect, why not simply desactivating it?

You can rest on the second floor of Falcon's Flight or in the cave to Lost Town if you've cleared all deathclaws (too bad the cop guarding the entrance wouldn't believe in you)
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sultangurde

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Post Wed Jul 20, 2016 5:55 am

Re: Mod feedback

About merchants i like the choice you have, either kill child abusing merchant or help him and have access to the shop.
I personally killed him and the only item i actually missed is 7,62mm ammo for M249 SAW or antimater rifle (assuming you got YK32 pulse pistol from him before).
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Daemon

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Post Wed Jul 20, 2016 8:06 am

Re: Mod feedback

stamstamstam wrote:If you don't like that healing effect, why not simply desactivating it?


Sadly, healing effect can't be simpy deactivated, it's hard-coded feature.


stamstamstam wrote:Looting is valid to gain ressources, but when I'm opening chests and lockers next to imperial soldiers and they're not saying anything about it, it's slightly immersion breaking.
"No problem, you can take those ammos and those grenades stranger, we won't need those".


I don't disagree that there're some freely accessible containers with too valuable stuff. That's somethig we can fix if we know specific problematic places. I'll check main imperial building then. Thanks.
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ddguy71

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Post Wed Jul 20, 2016 10:54 am

Re: Mod feedback

Waiting's healing effect is miniscule in comparison to the hassle of having to taverse locations in order to speed up time, which is simply tedious and detracts from the experience.

I also have to agree on quests' imbalaced rewards.
2 examples:

1. Rat hole - if you side with Julian, unless you killed off some of Alexa's men beforehand, you're going to have a very hard time killing her and her gang as Julian sends you undermanned. The loot is nice but it's not a jackpot.
If you side with Alexa her men practically win the battle for you.
Plus you get to get all the guns off Julians men and Julian's gun stash which are way more valuable.

2. Albuquerque - Siding with Empire gives you 3000 caps and the Emperor's handshake, Siding with Anonym gives you about 10 000 caps plus all the guns you pick off the dead soldiers which are worth at least twice as much.

3. There are too few weapons able to go against power armor - in fallout 2 heavy guns had bozar and vindicator minigun, small guns had gauss pistols and gauss rifles and energy weapons had the Y2K-something plasma weapons. You could buy those weapons in LA (bozar in NCR) without ever having to go against an Enclave trooper to get them. You could also purchase power armor there.

In Resurrection there's only one merchant who sells combat armor and he's killable in a quest.
I haven't found any way of obtaining M249SAW other than joining the hunters.
I also haven't found any way of obtaining power armor yet.

Often for some reason my companions will skip their rounds in combat which is especially taxing when I'm being attacked by a patrol of 7 ghouls including 4 with power armor.
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Ractaros96

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Location: Poland

Post Wed Jul 20, 2016 11:43 am

Re: Mod feedback

ddguy71 wrote:1. Rat hole - if you side with Julian, unless you killed off some of Alexa's men beforehand, you're going to have a very hard time killing her and her gang as Julian sends you undermanned. The loot is nice but it's not a jackpot.
If you side with Alexa her men practically win the battle for you.
Plus you get to get all the guns off Julians men and Julian's gun stash which are way more valuable.


You still can resolve conflict in Rat Hole without firing a single bullet, you can do one job for each side before that that yields 2000+ caps and after resolving it you'll get Alexia's stuff and Julian will give you access to his armory.

ddguy71 wrote:2. Albuquerque - Siding with Empire gives you 3000 caps and the Emperor's handshake, Siding with Anonym gives you about 10 000 caps plus all the guns you pick off the dead soldiers which are worth at least twice as much.


Siding with Aran will still yield you several guns from dead troops.

ddguy71 wrote:3. There are too few weapons able to go against power armor - in fallout 2 heavy guns had bozar and vindicator minigun, small guns had gauss pistols and gauss rifles and energy weapons had the Y2K-something plasma weapons. You could buy those weapons in LA (bozar in NCR) without ever having to go against an Enclave trooper to get them. You could also purchase power armor there.


YK32 Pulse Pistol is nice enough, as for other weapons you may be right, because I didn't play with other than energy weapons.

PS: You couldn't purchase Power Armor in San Francisco (LA was in Fallout 1), you could get it from BoS after doing quest. Funny thing that you could accually get better Enclave Power Armor while doing that quest.

ddguy71 wrote:In Resurrection there's only one merchant who sells combat armor and he's killable in a quest.


You could always buy that armor, before killing him.

ddguy71 wrote:I also haven't found any way of obtaining power armor yet.


The first one you can get by joining Mutant Hunter's and getting information from Camp of Mutants. Then, if you agree to attack Rebirth base, you'll be rewarded with it.
The second one is in Rebirth base at level 3, but Im not sure, if you can get it without killing anyone.
The third one is a reward for ambushing Mutant Hunter's Leader in Camp of Mutants. You can get that quest from Supermutant's Boss.
There is also another way of getting first Power Armor without doing that quest in Camp of Mutants, but you need high sneak and lockpick skills and you still need to join Mutant Hunters.
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sultangurde

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Post Wed Jul 20, 2016 11:58 am

Re: Mod feedback

I am not 100% sure, but getting Power Armor from Mutant Hunters after getting info about Rebirth Base didnt work for me.
When i came back to Sebastian with Holodisc from Mutant Base, the only dialogue options were fight or go to prison.
Propably did something wrong or speech 15 is not enough :)
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Ractaros96

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Post Wed Jul 20, 2016 12:00 pm

Re: Mod feedback

sultangurde wrote:I am not 100% sure, but getting Power Armor from Mutant Hunters after getting info about Rebirth Base didnt work for me or i did something wrong.
When i came back to Sebastian with Holodisc from Mutant Base, the only dialogue options end up with fight or imprisoning me.
Propably did something wrong or speed 15 is not enough :)


You shouln't have told him your true story. If you did, he'll know from that holodisk that you're in fact a ghoul.
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sultangurde

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Post Wed Jul 20, 2016 12:02 pm

Re: Mod feedback

Ractaros96 wrote:
sultangurde wrote:I am not 100% sure, but getting Power Armor from Mutant Hunters after getting info about Rebirth Base didnt work for me or i did something wrong.
When i came back to Sebastian with Holodisc from Mutant Base, the only dialogue options end up with fight or imprisoning me.
Propably did something wrong or speed 15 is not enough :)


You shouln't have told him your true story. If you did, he'll know from that holodisk that you're in fact a ghoul.


I am pretty sure there was no other options, except of standard questions. Gonna check today again.
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Ractaros96

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Post Wed Jul 20, 2016 12:09 pm

Re: Mod feedback

sultangurde wrote:
Ractaros96 wrote:
sultangurde wrote:I am not 100% sure, but getting Power Armor from Mutant Hunters after getting info about Rebirth Base didnt work for me or i did something wrong.
When i came back to Sebastian with Holodisc from Mutant Base, the only dialogue options end up with fight or imprisoning me.
Propably did something wrong or speed 15 is not enough :)


You shouln't have told him your true story. If you did, he'll know from that holodisk that you're in fact a ghoul.


I am pretty sure there was no other options, except of standard questions. Gonna check today again.


You could have told him that you just want to destroy Rebirth and some other one. There where 3 dialogue options in total.

PS: I have made the same mistake in my 2nd playthrough.
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NyuKuro

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Post Sat Jul 23, 2016 6:38 am

Re: Mod feedback

Is the Emperor's handshake a perk? What does it do?

Also, I've already done the vault thing with Aran and I still havent got it.

is there another quest involving aran?
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laclongquan

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Post Sat Jul 23, 2016 9:00 am

Re: Mod feedback

Feedback for players on early game

1. The necklace quest. You can totally plant the necklace to the logical place before you tell the bitch to check again. The hint is drug the character so they dont notice what you are doing.

2. The Alexa conclusion. This is a reminder back to the day of the Den's Metzger fight. You dont have to fight that battle right there and then. You can just wait until you get more companions before initiating that fight. I can finish that quest the nonviolent way but I like the loots very much so I get Keri before fight. Also, dont hesitate to heal Julian yourself even if he has his stims.

The role of your companion is to be bullet magnets so there's fewer flying toward you and Julian. Meanwhile, a few tactical SMG burst to the back of two most dangerous gals sporting SMG are a big decisive factor.
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stamstamstam

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Post Sat Jul 23, 2016 12:29 pm

Re: Mod feedback

- In my playthrough, I managed to attack Alexa with Julian's people.
I mentioned this before, but I prefer the first half of the game because there's no show stopper like I can find in the late game.
There are too many ways to screw the progression, instead of ways to circumvent a bad situation as offered early game.
Well, it's my vision of the game after my first playthrough, I feel the game is made much easier with some skills (speech most notably).

- I didn't write a list down of locations, but I felt it was basically almost everywhere, specifically in guarded locations. No container should be "lootable" if there's a guard around, that would give the "sneak" skill a much greater importance. (and it's not like those containers contain essential stuffs).

- Imperial city questline fell short for me, after risking my life and helpin Aran, I was rewarded with... being rejected for applying to the Mutants Hunter before even hearing of the Imperial City.
I still feel that it's not completely relevant, I would have rather Aran offer the player to reject and promise not to deal with Mutants Hunter anymore.

- In my playthrough, I also told Sebastian about my story (I think there weren't any other dialog option). After getting the holodisk from Mutants Camp, the only option for talking back to Sebastian is death...

- I was never able to obtain the Combat Armor and the YK32 pistol from that child abusing merchant because at that time I didn't have enough caps for that. I couldn't guess that soon after I would have to kill the guy during a quest. And I could even less guess that his stuff would be magically protected with a disappearing device called explosive.

- Based on the comments, I won't be able to get any Power Armor. In general, I wouldn't mind, but in that case, I find it a bit unfair as I feel it's because I didnt tag "speech" skill. I'm sure my playthrough would have been completely different with that skill.

- Also, sometimes, I feel some dialog options are bit blurry, like sometimes there's no way to guess the outcome of some of the dialog lines (pointing specifically that dialog line with Sebastian, that has dramatical effects).
90% of the dialogs are top notch, but based on my experience, I felt some parts were still a bit rough.

- How do you drug characters during the necklace quest?

- Maybe it's because of the bitter outcome of my first playthrough, but I couldn't enjoy the last part of the mod anymore, it feels too much of a hassle if you were unfortunate with some dialog options or not tagging the right skills.
I never experienced that sort of frustration with the original fallout games, and I know this is pure hobbyist work, but that mod is so good that it's impossible not to compare with original material.
Also, until end game, exploration has always been rewarded in some way, finding a character that can unblock your situation, or finding an item with same effect. Late game feels much more straight forward and doesn't allow much of a side path.

Anyway, it's mostly frustration speaking, and I would have loved to experience the same enjoyment through the whole progression.
There's probably a little something that could be done to smoothen these road bumps and avoid that kind of situation.

Peace out.
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